Can Bristlenose plecs hold Venom in them barbs????

Ive heard this a few times and now it has been drawn to my attention again by my dad...

He has a 5ft tank full of cichlids and swears blind the F1 Starlight i gave him has killed most of his top malawi's and Mbuna's....
I laughed at first at the thought of the ancistrus species having venom but how he has explained it has got me thinking...

Week by week another malawi would be dead in the morning with no explanation?? my dad has been into fishkeeping way before i was born so no's alot more than me so he assure's me is water is spot on and ive also seen the test's......

There is nothing in the tank that could pose a threat to such a strong fish like the Mbuna but to my dads surprise he witnessed this..

He said he saw one of his larger Mbuna's having a go at the starlight i gave him it went close to pecking at its eye's but missed more times than not..
The plec is about 4.5 inches now so at a good size to strike back...
He said he has seen the cichlids having a go at it before but the plec normally brushes it off with its tale and thats normally the end of that ..

But the Mbuna pecked one time to many and the plec turned and launched itself at the Mbuna, chased it and hit it 3 times in the side with its hooks/barbs...
The Mbuna istantly went mad and started swimming upside down and lay on its side?????????????

Its so far survived a day but he say's its now lost all colour and wont make it??

There is no real damage to the Mbuna???

This seems very strange to me how the Mbuna would react this way instanly after being attacked...

Its also strange how every 3-4 days another ends up doing the exact same thing.....

I no The common Bristlenose probably wouldnt have venom due to the fact they are tank breed and will loose all wild instincts eventually...

But this Starlight i gave him is an F1 from my wild caught parents from the Amazon in brazil so in my eyes a species from the amazon could easily hold venom,

Its a true known fact that in the wild most animals/predators with barbs/spikes e.t.c hold venom so could this be possible????

Could this also explain why so many poeple loose fish to the mystery illness???

Lets see what you lot think about this and see if you can do a bit of research...

i have already found a few things on catfish with venom but i aint posting untill iam 100% certain....


Thanks all..............CuRbY,............

i don't know about the plecos, but have read a few of the cories have venom in their spines. usually the ones with orange fins. like sterbai, haroldschultzi, gossei. i guess it's possible for the plecos to also have venom.

Very interesting-- I would never have thunked it.

J

To be honest that is the reason that I have never "held" my BN's, because I was under the assumption that they have poisonous barbs. Akin I believe to a bee sting to us, but would imagine it's a whole lot worse for a fish.

I have know BN's with attitude in the past, so maybe this one has decided he wants to be alone LOL

I have some experience with poison dart frogs so I'll approach this from that angle.

Most of their venom is derived from what they eat. Tank raised specimens are not nearly as poisonous. Also most venomous creatures are very brightly colored which might explain why wild plecos have the brighter colors and later generations are not quite as colorful.

Certainly something to look into further.

Ive heard this before mate but i cannot find anything on the ancistrus being venomous although their was a study done and its believed theirs over 1600 species of catfish believed to be venomous. this one is a strange behavior all round as Ive found mbuna tend to leave bristlenose alone. as for your dads bristlenose striking the mbuna and it then lying on its side i would say the fish as suffered from swim blader damage or some sort of internal damage rather than being poisoned. if you're dad is finding dead fish every other day and all the water is fine i would keep a very close eye on them at feeding time as this sounds like it could be the first stage of bloat the odd fish just dying for no apparent reason when feeding his fish they should all dart for the food if you watch closely if their suffering from the first stage of bloat the fish my look as though its feeding and will take in food then swim down and spit it back out or will dart for the food then not take any in and they may look OK with no sort of bloating at this point. I'm not saying this is the case and it could just be the bristlenose thats bumping them off. it's is a possibility it could be bloat and thought i would just point it out to you.

I will tell him to watch out for that mate.....good thinking mate...

I thought there was an article about a new species of pleco which was in fact venomous but I can't recall the L no they assigned to it.

its a bit of strange one that im not sure of either but then again they are its only defence so they could well have it would be like the daddy long legs other wise most poision spider in the world but no teeth to release the venom im gone to have a good look in to this because other species of fish that have spikes can be posionus

I could imagine a whack from a largish bristlenoses deadly switchblades would be pretty fatal to a curious cichlid (I say curious, but we all know these things just love to eat plec eyes), not doubt one good thrash with them could take one down if the plec was agitated enough. May be something for your dad to consider getting the plec his own tank, as I could see a lot of dead cichlids or even a plec with his eyes plucked out in the future

I spent an hour or so trawling the literature on bristlenose in the scientific journals and can't find any reference to a poison or venom, but that said it wasnt explicitly denied either. just by the by..who know that male salifin mollys (wild type) are poisonous!!!!! they can spit the venom like a cobra!!!

i also spent hours looking with no luck...and it just goes to show with the molly's that not everything is as it seems....

is youre dad still having the problem with the bristlenose???